Podcasts

Makes sense, even though I can't stand marin maybe I'll listen

In 2019 I decided I needed to get into new podcasts and started saying "yes" to all the ones people recommend me. It's still incredibly difficult to get into a new show, but the effort has paid off. Here are some recent thoughts

-Doughboys is INCREDIBLE. I've liked Wiger and Mitchell for awhile, but this is truly the highest level of banal conversation between nerdy idiots. It reminds me of my friends tremendously. They don't get the highest profile guests, but I don't think it matters that much. If you're not familiar, they eat at and review chain restaurants. It's a couple comedians sharing dumb opinions about Wendy's and Domino's. It's fun!

-Chapo Trap House was way better than I expected. I didn't realize the hosts were all Twitter personalities that I was vaguely familiar with. I guess I'm part of the Dirtbag Left?? The Pod Save America dweebs are such shit and I'm thrilled I've never listened to it. They eviscerated Lovett at the top of this week's pod for trying to muck up "Medicare for All" by talking about "increased access to affordable private insurance" and suggesting that Americans don't care about the means as long as they have "a comfortable plan they like". Bleh. Listening to these guys for 10 minutes really gets you on board with the more radical left agenda. They compelling argue that changing the Democratic Party is the fastest way to leftist goals like universal health care and a green economy, rather than simply grinding out elections versus Republicans (and they argue you can be more electorally effective with a well-packaged leftist message anyway). I'll be back!

-Similiarly, the 538 Politics podcast is a good window into the more status quo/establishment POV (with some data-forward views). I love their reporter Clare Malone who balances out Nate Silver's contrarian bullshit perspective (which, as a natural contrarian white dude I fully understand). Their series on "How Democratic 2020 Challenger X Could Win" is excellent.

-The Teacher's Lounge on Earwolf is fucking funny because these four dudes are such idiots. I've heard them do similar improv on Comedy Bang! Bang! before, but this is them in their unstructured glory. I think there's a vague narrative throughout the "seasons" of the pod, but who cares. I need to listen more, but this is a podcast where four white dudes with stupid voices do stupid improv where they're fake burnout teachers. It's cool.

-High & Mighty is a pod from Jon Gabrus, who I love on Comedy Bang! Bang! He's leans in pretty tough to some edgelord/offensive humor that doesn't always land, but I think he's such a great character. He does an annual episode called the Thanksgiving Power Hour which is wild, unscripted nonsense. I haven't dove into much else on the pod, but if you like Gabrus and/or Long Island generally it's good.

-Dunc'd On is the most nerdy, banal podcast I've ever heard and I love it. It's the perfect podcast to put on in the background or to fall asleep. No production quality, nothing they talk about is actually important. It's just incessantly detailed and analytic NBA talk. They put out SO MANY episodes. This is great filler content if you wanna put something on and forget. Shout out Danny LeRoux!

Those Chapo slobs are anti-Irish/Italian bigots and therefore they can go to hell as far as I'm concerned.

I was listening to Chapo for a while last year. When they have on a guest like Varoufakis or Bhaskar Sunkara I will listen to that episode, but otherwise their shtick gets pretty tiring. It's too easy to dunk on the Pod Save America dweebs and it isn't like their audience needs convincing. It can be funny sometimes and I appreciate it, but dunking on the libs isn't really my thing. I do remember them having some incredibly good coverage of Puerto Rico in the aftermath of the hurricane where they explored the actions of "disaster capitalists" as well as the response of global financial institutions like the IMF and World Bank, which was just excellent journalism. They also do a lot of Italian jokes, that is true.

Lately I've been listening to the BBC Global News podcast, which is exactly as exciting as it sounds. I really do recommend it though. It is just so nice to be able to absorb the news from a decentralized, global perspective. It always annoys me that literally every single bit of information I would ever get about the Middle East, as just one example, from an American news source would solely ever be about American actions or interests in the region. It's important to understand the historical role of both European imperialism and the present-day role of American occupations on the political realities of Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, etc. But not everything in a rich and diverse region can be reduced to such a narrow, self-serving perspective. It's also just a good thing to start and end your day with.

chrondog wrote:The Pod Save America dweebs are such shit and I'm thrilled I've never listened to it. They eviscerated Lovett at the top of this week's pod

As someone who was dragged to live shows of both Pod Save America and Lovett or Leave It (what the difference between these shows even is I could not tell you) my envy for this statement is palpable.

Regarding podcasts and the recent discussion here of the military-industrial complex, I thought this was interesting, particularly near the end where they talk about Obama's electoral message vs. actions and then what Trump has done. I don't know if I agree with either of them but I think any serious discussion of The Blob has to have this kind of depth/nuance as a starting point or else it won't really go anywhere.

https://www.lawfareblog.com/lawfare-podcast-progressive-critiques-liberal-internationalism

WP64 wrote:dunking on the libs isn't really my thing

i like it more now than i used to. like i said, i think there's a compelling case that the big leftist priorities require window moving and organization building today for policy action in 10-20 years, and that the current Democratic Party isn't equipped to make those moves. i've loved the dunking on Kamala and Cory Booker so far. enjoyed the Klobuchar bashing the other day. not that i wouldn't enthusiastically vote/support these people, but i'm just totally done with faux optics and i think that's where a lot of the left is at.

in the colloquial language of today there's no contradiction in calling Beto an "oil money neoliberal goblin" and potentially crying if he was elected president. we're complicated humans man!! Nancy Pelosi can be trash for minimizing the Green New Deal and still be a liberal lion who I want on my team 99 times out of 100.

we're changing the game.

That kinda talk from people on the left gives me heart palpatations. Because for a lot of people there absolutely IS a contradiction. Indeed, it's been one of the defining traits of democrats for about as far as I can remember. Here's hoping the game is indeed changing. Indeed.

Thought this thread bump would have something to do with a small podcasting company - I lol'd at that thought 4 years ago; turns out I'm an idiot - selling to a legal music streaming company - also lol'd @ that 10 years ago, dum dum - for >$200mil.

chrondog wrote:i like it more now than i used to. like i said, i think there's a compelling case that the big leftist priorities require window moving and organization building today for policy action in 10-20 years, and that the current Democratic Party isn't equipped to make those moves. i've loved the dunking on Kamala and Cory Booker so far. enjoyed the Klobuchar bashing the other day. not that i wouldn't enthusiastically vote/support these people, but i'm just totally done with faux optics and i think that's where a lot of the left is at.

in the colloquial language of today there's no contradiction in calling Beto an "oil money neoliberal goblin" and potentially crying if he was elected president. we're complicated humans man!! Nancy Pelosi can be trash for minimizing the Green New Deal and still be a liberal lion who I want on my team 99 times out of 100.

we're changing the game.

I listened to their most recent episode today and was loving it. Also, I definitely agree with you about the importance of movement politics, which is something that the left-wing of the Democratic Party has done a really good job embracing (probably ever since Occupy). It is certainly reshaping political discourse and I also think that the window of political possibility is starting to broaden and move in new and really exciting directions.

I'm way further gone than you though. I don't imagine myself ever being on the same team as Nancy Pelosi or Cory Booker. Her comment about the "green dream or whatever" is ridiculous. She can fuck right off. I wouldn't vote for any Democrat as President in 2020 that isn't named either Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders (and possibly not even the former). I definitely agree with the Chapo dudes that the political aim of 2020 should be about widening the contradictions between centrist liberals and socialists. We ARE changing the game and now we need to start wresting actual political power from these twats.

Basically, it isn't satisfying enough to just be dunking on them. I want to defeat them, or rather, make it so they stop defeating themselves.

Duff... wrote:Indeed, it's been one of the defining traits of democrats for about as far as I can remember.

So yeah.

Maybe I am struggling with reading comprehension, but I am not sure what point you are making, Duff. What is the defining trait of Democrats?

The basis of my politics is to reverse and counter the Reagan revolution. Things like AO-C and Merkley's Green New Deal proposal are really exciting because they force a radical rethinking of the fundamental relationship between states and markets. Ever since the collapse of the New Deal coalition (which was also deeply racist and exclusionary), the American State has adopted a radical posture towards markets wherein they not only fail to regulate them effectively, but they view any sort of interference as anathema to freedom. I'm not interested in winning elections if we aren't challenging that original flawed premise because it is impossible to draft effective legislation around healthcare, housing, or the environment while also accepting that ideological stance. There isn't anything "radical" about that either.

"I'm willing to lose elections to reactionary nutcases who are going to crack down on refugees, the poor, women, LGTBQ people, etc., if I don't get exactly everything I want and exactly nothing I don't from the person nominated by the democratic party" has been a defining trait of democrats. That anyone has to have this conversation in 2019 is leading me to the conclusion that human beings are inherently too stupid to live and the coming apocalypse is exactly what we deserve.

The two modern Democratic Presidents have a pretty abysmal track record when it comes to defending the poor (Clinton's welfare 'reform'), defending women, extending civil liberties to LGBTQ Americans (don't ask, don't tell was somehow an acceptable compromise at the time), and the immigration enforcement policies of Obama were fucking heinous. Obama sucked so badly. After a fucking huge popular mandate wherein the Democrats controlled the Senate (for possibly the last time in our lives), that man appointed a Cabinet of Goldman Sachs executives to appease the financial services industry in order to signal to the market. It's disgusting and unforgivable. I will never forgive that shit.

And when it comes to the environment and healthcare, which are perhaps the only two universal political issues, the Democrats are close to an actual deathwish.

I'm not asking to seize the means of production. I'm just asking for a Party that represents a clear and obvious difference from the barbaric, market-centric politics of the Republican Party where American families are going bankrupt because of illnesses and an entire generation have been turned into indentured servants because they can't afford an education. Those are basic demands and it should be a litmus test for any Democratic candidate.

You dudes who listen to Chapo Trap House - which I'm not really a fan of, partly on account of production value and partly because the quasi-militant debaser thing isn't so much a position as a reaction imo - have you heard Citations Needed? I like it a lot. Still very take-downy - see the recent episode on Mike Rowe - but really well-reasoned and slick in the ways I want it to be. Iunno, maybe you'll find it interesting.

If you can't see a clear fucking obvious difference between Obama and Trump jesus fucking christ.

If Booker gets the nomination, he's going to be president, or Trump is. It's that simple. Fight like hell for your principles and your nominee and then whatever happens back the nominee. Or you might as well wear a MAGA hat.

No one let me stop you from talking about podcasts, I'm out.

The new quote feature on this board is a giant piece of shit, but I'm referring to WP saying he wouldn't vote for non-Sanders or Warren candidates:

This is still self-defeating. Movement politics and recognizing that the status quo is not enough doesn't mean you aren't required to use your vote pragmatically in my opinion. I won't allow my privilege to say that Trump winning and potential systemic changes that come along with that are worth the pain for the people that will be harmed by his administration.

To me, abstaining from voting is the most asinine form of virtue signaling. We should be virtuous and pragmatic at the same time.

Duff... wrote:That kinda talk from people on the left gives me heart palpatations. Because for a lot of people there absolutely IS a contradiction. Indeed, it's been one of the defining traits of democrats for about as far as I can remember. Here's hoping the game is indeed changing. Indeed.

IMO intolerance is way way up across the political spectrum. I am very guilty of it as well. I am extremely intolerant of regressive or even status quo economic and social views that I believe are patriarchal, racist, colonial, exploitative, and straight up bullshit. I am intolerant of milquetoast politicians who are unable to speak to reality and are playing a political game that is so divorced from humanity and experience that the cognitive dissonance actively makes our whole society depressed.

At the same time, our society is a massive pluralistic experience where people must be allowed to have their own views. And I seek to understand and acknowledge the environment in which those views are formed and expressed. It's extremely valuable and important to me personally to sympathize with why someone might be racist or why they grew up to think that abortion must be stopped.

Even though Nancy Pelosi and I see the political landscape so so differently, I think it's right to acknowledge we're on the same team. That we have shared values and if she wasn't someone who was basically living in a completely different world than me, we could reach common ground and consensus. Who knows what she would say/believe if she didn't have to go through the political process to accomplish things. Maybe we're more alike? Maybe we're even more different. 

I have voted in every election since I was 18 (including midterms, local, and special elections) and there isn't a single instance I've cast a vote for a partisan office for anyone other than a Democrat and that won't be changing, despite the fact that I'm much more closely aligned policy wise with DSA.

At the same time, there's a bunch of morons in DSA who scream about "dismantling capitalism" and haven't thought that idea through for more than 15 seconds. There's many degrees of being right/solidarity.

One of my big themes of 2019 is that the left needs way way more solidarity, even with those we have fundamental disagreements with.

it warms my heart to see my Congressperson Barbara Lee (the best representative on congress) passing the torch to the next generation: https://www.instagram.com/p/BthZpbEhZ4I/

WP64 wrote:The two modern Democratic Presidents have a pretty abysmal track record when it comes to defending the poor (Clinton's welfare 'reform'), defending women, extending civil liberties to LGBTQ Americans (don't ask, don't tell was somehow an acceptable compromise at the time), and the immigration enforcement policies of Obama were fucking heinous. Obama sucked so badly. After a fucking huge popular mandate wherein the Democrats controlled the Senate (for possibly the last time in our lives), that man appointed a Cabinet of Goldman Sachs executives to appease the financial services industry in order to signal to the market. It's disgusting and unforgivable. I will never forgive that shit.

And when it comes to the environment and healthcare, which are perhaps the only two universal political issues, the Democrats are close to an actual deathwish.

so privileged it hurts

and i don't disagree with you much on the policy

i just don't think that losing is the only way to get people to change

i think we can push the Democrats LEFT LEFT LEFT while still winning, it's up to the movement to do that

Michael K. wrote:You dudes who listen to Chapo Trap House - which I'm not really a fan of, partly on account of production value and partly because the quasi-militant debaser thing isn't so much a position as a reaction imo - have you heard Citations Needed? I like it a lot. Still very take-downy - see the recent episode on Mike Rowe - but really well-reasoned and slick in the ways I want it to be. Iunno, maybe you'll find it interesting.

subscribed to Citations Needed, will check back if i eventually get to it.

but why, i ask, does everything need to be a fully formed coherent position? Chapo Trap House is entertainment. it has a point of view, but individuals points of view should be individually motivated. i think the way we need a cultural proxy for our views in some ways shows how unserious we are about them. "oh i'm a Pod Save America liberal" doesn't mean jack shit. people who enjoy the tone of Chapo Trap House could all reasonably have very different views. 

i also have a tendency to dislike podcasts with stereotypically high production values, i.e. the NPR voice. i tried to listen to Criminal, but the NPR voice was so ridiculous i shut it off within seconds. fuck that breathy shit. i consume a lot of lo-fi roundtable discussions.

also, i wanna note that all this stuff i'm saying is based off listening to 1 episode of Chapo.

I’ve listened to several Pod Save America episodes and would struggle to figure out the appeal. It is extremely in the Obama/Clinton space with “quirky” commercials about home security and mattresses mixed in with their serious discussions.

Lovett is unbearable and the rest are as bland as a Banana Republic sweater. The pod represents everything I despise about the Democratic Party and the reason I fear someone like Booker or Harris will secure the nomination.

chrondog wrote:

Michael K. wrote:You dudes who listen to Chapo Trap House - which I'm not really a fan of, partly on account of production value and partly because the quasi-militant debaser thing isn't so much a position as a reaction imo - have you heard Citations Needed? I like it a lot. Still very take-downy - see the recent episode on Mike Rowe - but really well-reasoned and slick in the ways I want it to be. Iunno, maybe you'll find it interesting.

subscribed to Citations Needed, will check back if i eventually get to it.

but why, i ask, does everything need to be a fully formed coherent position?
[...]
i also have a tendency to dislike podcasts with stereotypically high production values, i.e. the NPR voice. i tried to listen to Criminal, but the NPR voice was so ridiculous i shut it off within seconds. fuck that breathy shit. i consume a lot of lo-fi roundtable discussions.

I don't think everything - or even anything - needs to be fully formed and coherent. I won't bore you with the particulars, but there's loads of music, film, and literature I love that's incoherent, lo-fi, and half-baked. I just personally have a difficult time with the lo-fi roundtable thing in the podcasting medium because I'm constantly frustrated by someone starting a thread that sounds super interesting to me, only to jump off on another tangent or be interrupted by someone else. And then I feel like I'm hanging with my dudes and end up shouting at the radio - i.e. into my airpods - to hold up for a second because I'm trying to find a tether. Maybe better put, the lo-fi roundtable thing feels like an invitation to participate, but the the medium itself rejects participation.

That breathy-NPR thing is...yeah. Not great. But I love listening to Radiolab and More Perfect and 99% Invisible and the like, where an idea is proffered, evidenced, countered, and ultimately nudged off into the ether for a listener - like me! - to mull over in its (at least intended) entirety. It's a chunk of thought to chew on, digest, regurgitate, and maybe produce something useful and new out of. I like that process a lot. I find it really difficult to exist in the fray. I like the idea of chaos, and fray, and happening, but I'm not super comfortable in that space. The Chapo podcast makes me feel...tense and confused. That's not a bad thing to be, probably. I could certainly do with occupying that space better, at least. But I can't take anything away from Chapo and do something with it. But when I listen to Citations Needed, there's a throughline I can follow that helps me sharpen my opinions, induce better actions, and understand both my privilege and responsibility a little bit better.

My eight year old is going through every Who Would Win episode right now which means I'm learning a lot about comic book and movie characters I was only mostly aware of.

I’m off for the next week and feel so happy I found Desert Oracle Radio to binge on. Wild stories about alien sightings & crazy shit that has gone down in the desert.