itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Mon Dec 26, 2016 9:27 pm

    And finally, because I'm admittedly self-absorbed, I have a lot of intellectual interests that align with these recent events. I'm fascinated by the rise of a so-called 'illberal international' being the true beginnings of the 21st century. Of course, it's also really scary. I'm constantly searching for interesting lenses to interpret all of this on a global level.

    It seems that Putin and post-Soviet Russia is the place to start, but I don't know enough on the subject. I know that IMF and World Bank economic liberalization programs, which was assisted by Harvard economists and somewhat tepidly executed by Yeltsin, was ultimately a huge failure. The end of history predictions were entirely contingent upon this being a success, which is an interesting side note to consider. Putin's rise, from the very little that I've read, as a neo-nationalist with expansionist ambitions has a lot to do with this larger crisis of economic shock therapy. Basically, Putin is just a corrupt multi-billionaire and oligarch who is able to appeal to disenfranchised Russians through nationalist rhetoric. The greatest catastrophe of the 20th century for Putin and his supporters was the fall of the Soviet Union, which really just means the waining of their geo-political power. This should all sound familiar and the atrocities visited upon the Chechen Muslim minorities should be a warning sign for liberal Westerners about the actual consequences of these supposed idiots.

    A clearer, and probably much harsher, reality is going to unfold throughout the next couple of years (French, German, Austrian, and possibly Italian parliamentary elections with potentially devastating results and the actual triggering of Brexit). Right now, everything is very uncertain. In a couple of years this will become more opaque to least understand, hopefully.

    Tl;dr: Shit is really, really fucked up. Gramsci, facing eerily similar global circumstances to our own, put it quite beautifully, "the old world is dying away, and the new world struggles to come forth; now is the time of monsters."
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by undo on Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:13 pm

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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:42 am

    She ran a terrible campaign, her politics are shit, and her husband is a bumbling asshole though.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:19 pm

    strongly disagree with all of that

    it's the American "winner take all" attitude that makes people think that if you lost, you did everything wrong.

    she wasn't fantastic or what many of us wanted, but she's not bad. the voters are bad. or, rather, they are what they are.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by undo on Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:13 pm

    Old news, but I want to find everyone involved in this and smack their skulls together.

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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by undo on Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:35 pm



    takeabow
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Sun Apr 02, 2017 4:08 am

    these are popular bumper stickers out here

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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:17 pm

    will this type of thinking ever end? https://nylon.com/articles/guy-praised-for-loving-curvy-wife-buzzfeed

    sure, this dude is a self-congraulatory doofus, but that's what 99% of people are on social media. he didn't make himself go viral or compel any outlet to write a piece praising his humanity. these kinds of "feel good" human interest stories are clickbait city in this era and make these shitty aggregator sites tons of money. "the bare minimum" goes viral because people like to click and read that someone normal did some normal shit. it's really not an instance of the "standards" being low for men (they are, but it's a whole different conversation altogether). female celebrities get written up for posting a single body-positive photo. any social content about "motherhood" is total clickbait. the way any woman's friends all comment "you look STUNNING!!" on all of their IG posts is praising the "bare minimum". social media celebrates the normal and the mundane. that's what it does.

    this whole methodology of cultural criticism is so fucking hollow. meme culture and virality are reflections of the culture we live in and it's values; memes are never going to reflect our highest aspirations as a society, otherwise they wouldn't be perpetuated. the way we make individuals the enemy rather than systems or institutions is insidious. the capitalistic incentive structures for media companies that prey on our basest instincts is a real thing that we could actually change and make different.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:32 pm

    chrondog wrote:this whole methodology of cultural criticism is so fucking hollow. meme culture and virality are reflections of the culture we live in and it's values; memes are never going to reflect our highest aspirations as a society, otherwise they wouldn't be perpetuated. the way we make individuals the enemy rather than systems or institutions is insidious. the capitalistic incentive structures for media companies that prey on our basest instincts is a real thing that we could actually change and make different.
    Agreed.

    Now that I'm out of school, I kind of want to pay my dues at DSA (it's only $40USD) or just find myself within an engaged public or political community, but I'm really disgusted by the whole dirtbag leftist shit and when I read comments like this on Washington Post articles describing the burgeoning, hip, chic and cool socialist movement I become an outright reactionary about it:
    The tone of the new socialist media can often be relentlessly ironic, surrealist and rude. Rather than policing it, DSA has embraced it. Christian Bowe, social media director for DSA, who tweets under the handle “Larry Website,” celebrated the 25,000th DSA membership by asking socialists to come up with terrible, garish memes. They obliged, with images of Shrek, Sonic the Hedgehog and legally embattled former Subway spokesman Jared Fogle commemorating the left’s new milestone.

    [Italian Communist Antonio] Gramsci proposed creating our own working-class culture which address our needs and vision,” he explained. “Memes are a snapshot of that; podcasts and publications like Jacobin and Current Affairs are extensions of it.”
    Nah. Fuck it.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:43 pm

    former LoPP boarder Feisty is a vocal critic of the DSA on her Twitter page which i still follow. she actually focuses on structural problems with the organization, because as a history PhD of course she would. she has good thoughts on why DSA has issues.

    i have many friends from the East Bay who joined DSA after the election. people posting social media photos from their meetings is a popular new thing. this guy who was in my AP Biology class is in the East Bay DSA's promotional video.

    i've considered myself a Democratic Socialist for about a decade now, but i am increasingly finding myself out of step with the politics of self-described "socialists".

    young "socialists" really are running the risk of losing everything that is powerful about socialism by reducing the discussion to "free college, heath care is a right, identity politics"

    these aren't really policies that would move us towards greater collectivization and socializing of opportunity, they're accounting issues. basically, the modern Bernie-inspired socialist movement is very very thin on ideas other than transferring wealth in a way that isn't very politically feasible.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Thu Aug 10, 2017 9:57 pm

    Structural issues internal to DSA as an organization? Or structural issues surrounding its political programme?

    I mostly agree with your criticism, Chrono. Although I do think advocating for free college and affirming access to health care as a human right are pretty big steps that are more than just 'accounting issues.'

    What are the bigger ideas that we should be focusing on when it comes to collectivization? Because usually when I push people on that they start sounding very Keynesian because it's really all about social investment strategies (job training, green/non-renewable energy, etc.) that could lead to another long-term and sustainable cycle of growth. I don't have a problem with any of that thinking necessarily and it should be incorporated in any centre-left political platform in the 'developed' world at this point, but it's really not that 'radical.' Not that radicalism is the point.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:16 pm

    Ҩ wrote:Structural issues internal to DSA as an organization? Or structural issues surrounding its political programme?

    the former.

    i think 'health care as a human right' is such a huge huge mistake. it almost fundamentally changes the meaning of what human rights are. human rights should not be marketized commodities. i am not for that justification in any way.

    i think single-payer healthcare is the most efficient allocation of resources and creates the best outcomes for society.

    i say they are accounting issues because all we're really talking about is having high earners subsidize college and health care for low earners. we're not talking about restructuring the public college or health care system in this country in a meaningful way, just changing who writes the check.

    making the tax structure more progressive, investing in public education and severely restricting "school choice", and tripling down on green energy and fighting climate change would be three great pillars of real socialist change.

    i don't believe Democratic Socialism is radical or should be associated with radicalism at all. by it's very definition it works through democratic institutions.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:03 pm

    I really don't know what you mean? What qualifies as a human right for you then? Legal concepts?

    The larger struggle around health care right now is that people don't think their bodies and health should be commodified and people are frustrated that the reality (or eventuality) of an illness can mean death because they are no longer profitable for private insurance companies. The solution of the Affordable Care Act is to use billions of dollars of taxpayer money to subsidize private insurers rather than socializing the risk in other ways and using those billions of dollars to invest in medical innovation, driving down drug costs, or investing in research/training so that doctors don't enter their field with six-figures of fucking debt.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Nick on Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:56 am

    I think the DSA movement is very exciting & amazing in how quickly it's growing.

    That being said, when important elections come up (which is basically every election) I worry it'll create a schism in the party and voters will be so divided that Republicans will continue to win.

    The voting Republican base at least has a unifying message as despicable as it is. The entire Left in this country is wandering in the wilderness.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by reuben on Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:48 pm

    Chrono do you think healthcare should be a marketized commodity?
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:10 pm

    i think it has to be, given that we have to create incentives for research, education, and technology development. we already have doctor and nurse shortages in this country. i think there is some value in having health care tied to markets so that we use it efficiently, i.e. we shouldn't be screening people with $5000 x-ray machines anytime they ask for it. from an accounting perspective i think single-payer is the best model. i think the power of the Federal government to buy in bulk is a strong tool in lowering costs throughout the system overall. plus, third-party insurers are a total leech in the system.

    regardless of morality, i think it's bad public policy to let anyone go without health care because they can't afford it. universal Medicare that focuses on preventative care would save the system money in the long run. that's not to say that Medicare itself is a particularly efficient program; it's not. the current single-payer or government-run models like Medicare or the VA need massive reform as well.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:14 pm

    Ҩ wrote:I really don't know what you mean? What qualifies as a human right for you then? Legal concepts?

    Article 25 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights reads:

    (1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
    (2) Motherhood and childhood are entitled to special care and assistance. All children, whether born in or out of wedlock, shall enjoy the same social protection.

    which i had no idea.

    my issue is in turning the idea of "human rights" into an economic question. the question of ensuring universal health care is who is going to pay for it. the question of ensuring universal voting rights has some element of who is going to pay for it, but it's more about legal protections.

    if things like college and health care are considered human rights the state must ensure, there's really no limit to the amount of resources that must be spent on them. i think that is a question of social and political priorities, not a bare minimum of legal rights.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:43 pm

    chrondog wrote:this guy who was in my AP Biology class is in the East Bay DSA's promotional video.  

    lmao, here he is again. quoted and in the photo: http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/08/08/democratic_socialists_have_an_uneasy_alliance_with_the_democratic_party.html
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:26 pm

    i've defended Hillary plenty post-election because i think she ran a reasonable campaign and was defeated by cultural forces that few would've thought were predictive. my long and short take these days of the 2016 election is that the candidates presented themselves as they were and the American people chose ugliness; i find it hard to fault her for not pandering to that.

    this, however, is pure trash:


    this is 100% spin disguised as "hard, truth telling".

    Bernie was more fair to Hillary in 2016 than Hillary was to Obama in 2008, and now she's bitching to pander to her base and get her new Super PAC "fired up". this is what being a unifier looks like?

    i will literally never forget when Bill put on a fancy ass flannel to come at Bernie for no reason:
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:43 pm

    Man, I remember that. Hillary had gotten me so mad online.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by chrondog on Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:20 pm

    chrondog wrote:
    chrondog wrote:this guy who was in my AP Biology class is in the East Bay DSA's promotional video.  

    lmao, here he is again. quoted and in the photo: http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/08/08/democratic_socialists_have_an_uneasy_alliance_with_the_democratic_party.html

    should i be turned off by this East Bay DSA event description?

    Motion From The Floor: DSA Dance Party wrote:As Emma Goldman once said, “A revolution without dancing is not a revolution worth having.” So, do Emma proud: shed your 9-5, strap on your dancing shoes, and prepare to make some motion on The Legionnaire’s top floor. This is a post-work party for a post-work society, baby! Come together with your comrades for a mix of disco, soul, and techno. Wear something revolutionary: red, black, and sparkly encouraged!

    - FT. local legend Page Hodel as DJ!!!
    - Specialty cocktails designed by The Legionnaire bartenders
    - Raffles and prizes
    - A dance-a-thon
    - "Shout-Out" dedications for sale

    *Funds being raised for EBDSA and DSA's Hurricane Harvey Relief*

    $10-20, NOTAFLOF

    The second floor is not disability accessible, but the party can spill on to the first floor where the main bar is located (and the music can still be heard).

    Stay tuned for more details!
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Duff... on Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:07 pm

    why is everyone so stupid
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by Ҩ on Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:41 pm

    This is totally unrelated but I was arguing with this dude at work the other day because he kept saying voting was a pointless waste of his time. I was actually getting really agitated about it. Two days later I found out that he has a felony record, so maybe that's the reason for his apathy.

    Somewhat more related, maybe. The most recent New York Times coverage of Donald Trump as a political maverick untethered to either of the major parties is beyond shameful. They really need to cut it out.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by raj gibson on Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:06 am

    Link? I read the "Bound to No Party..." article from yesterday, and it didn't call him a "maverick" or otherwise seem to be praising him.
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    Re: itt we act disgusted/-appointed at left wing buffoons

    Post by undo on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:19 pm

    How do you rebuff these ideas that are actually getting into people's heads

    You shouldn't protest against white supremacists, they want the attention and that's what helps them recruit others.

    If you just ignore them they will stop marching and just fade away.

    You should never punch nazis because it gives them a justified reason to attack back.

    Antifa, whoever that is and whatever they stand for, idk, should stop dressing in black and hiding their faces, it makes them look like the scary and dangerous ones.

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